Is There Something Wrong With Americans?

[MJB]

This is the third incident in a week that just beggars belief.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-65325867

It follows the shooting of two teenage cheerleaders after one accidentally tried to get in the wrong car, and a 16 year old boy was gunned down after he knocked on the wrong door when he went to collect his younger siblings from a friend's house.

[willien]

If the mass and individual shootings were reported as happening in any other state/country in the world, then no one would pretend they were not happening in a failed state.

[neilt3]

"Is There Something Wrong With Americans?"

You really need to ask ?

This is what happens when any moron can have a gun . Try and take them off them for their own good and they'll be riots .
Would you let a five year old play with a box of razor blades or matches ? same difference .

[andy]

STATISTICS ON DAILY GUN VIOLENCE IN AMERICA
DAILY GUN VIOLENCE IMPACTING PEOPLE OF ALL AGES IN THE U.S.
Every day, 321 people are shot in the United States. Among those:

111 people are shot and killed
210 survive gunshot injuries
95 are intentionally shot by someone else and survive
42 are murdered
65 die from gun suicide
10 survive an attempted gun suicide
1 is killed unintentionally
90 are shot unintentionally and survive
1 is killed by legal intervention*
4 are shot by legal intervention and survive
1 died but the intent was unknown
12 are shot and survive but the intent was unknown

DAILY GUN VIOLENCE IMPACTING CHILDREN AND TEENS (1-17)
Every day, 22 children and teens (1-17) are shot in the United States. Among those:

5 die from gun violence
3 are murdered
17 children and teens survive gunshot injuries
8 are intentionally shot by someone else and survive
2 children and teens either die from gun suicide or survive an attempted gun suicide
8 children and teens are unintentionally shot in instances of family fire — a shooting involving an improperly stored or misused gun found in the home resulting in injury or death

From the first site that showed up in a search...
www.bradyunited.org/key-statistics

[dreampolice]

Yes. Not just with the guns. They are Fecked up, what with the abortion bills, the don’t say gay act in Florida, book bans, their attitudes to race, the words that Trump and co can say with no real comeback etc

Even though my sister and her family are all US citizens we have no intention of going out there again to visit. It really has no appeal anymore.

[JohnY]

It's a very sick society. We are heading the same way except in the matter of legally held guns.

[gray1720]

Apr 21, 2023 9:47:27 GMT JohnY said:

It's a very sick society. We are heading the same way except in the matter of legally held guns.

... and that I was thinking we'd TaKen bAC CoNtrOl...

[geoffr]

I think the problem is far wider than the United States, in this country we have the "UK Counter Disinformation Unit" translated that, to me, means "thought police". If you should question the general belief on climate change, that is disinformation and has to be countered. It is my opinion that we should be questioning "The Science" and, in relation to "Net Zero" we should be asking "what if we have got it wrong?". That's not to suggest that we deny climate change simply to suggest that we must, reasonably, consider the possibility. In the USA the "thought police" have sacked a head teacher for showing a work of art, all be it a naked man, to pupils. Books with uncomfortable or politically incorrect content are banned. Without respect for contrary opinions our society is being destroyed.

Guns in the USA? Its part of the same problem. Once you stop respecting people who disagree with you there is the risk of becoming afraid of anyone who doesn't hold with your opinions and beliefs. In one of the recent incidents a man shot through his front door, he feared for his safety because someone rang his door bell! As JohnY says it is a sick society, on both sides of the pond. Fear of difference is, to some extent, understandable but we have to overcome it and accept that everybody is different. We also have to accept that someone who has a different view from our own may actually be right.

Unfortunately, some opinions are being held up as "left" or "right" views despite people on both sides of the political spectrum holding those views. Polarisation is becoming rife but, talk quietly to someone and you will find that they are reasonable and not at all biased to one side or the other, get a bunch of people together and it is a different story.

As it happens I am in agreement with the alternative second amendment, the right to arm bears. They would probably behave more moderately than many human gun owners.

[Kath]

Guns are sadly but just one issue. My husband is American and he has said repeatedly that IF we were to go for a visit, there's a limited number of states he'd be prepared to travel to. Basically no red states. But I have no interest in going at all. We'd certainly never move back. I would encourage anyone with dual nationality to keep that very quiet and never darken the doors of the USA!

I overheard my son talking to some of his friends last night and he was saying that the weird thing about America's attitude to the taliban etc is that the only reason they abhor/are against them is because they are not Christian. The belief that women are second class citizens who should not be allowed to be educated, own property, make their own money, have a say in whether or not they get married, have any kind of agency over their own bodies is shared by both the Taliban and the far right GOP members. Same with homosexuality and trans rights. There's very little difference. There's now a bill being pushed through in the US that says girls can't discuss menstruation at school. Even if their parents haven't told them about it, they have 't yet had any sex ed. at school and their period starts before the cut off age (which I believe is about 12...way after a lot of girls start menstruating) they will be criminalised for asking for help at school. Of course these are the people who think Michaelangelo's David is pornographic. There's no help for them really.

[squeamishossifrage]

A weekend reading list, for those who enjoy either masochistic depression or 'serves you right' schadenfreude:-

HOW CIVIL WARS START

And How to Stop Them

By Barbara F. Walte

THE NEXT CIVIL WAR

Dispatches From the American Future

By Stephen Marche

Essentially, the authors expound the view that the US is either about to have another civil war or are still fighting the last one. 

My own opinion is that to run the world's principal super power, a modern state, on a two hundred and thirty year old document is a recipe for civil and political disaster.

[willien]

Apr 21, 2023 16:24:14 GMT squeamishossifrage said:

A weekend reading list, for those who enjoy either masochistic depression or 'serves you right' schadenfreude:-

HOW CIVIL WARS START

And How to Stop Them

By Barbara F. Walte

THE NEXT CIVIL WAR

Dispatches From the American Future

By Stephen Marche

Essentially, the authors expound the view that the US is either about to have another civil war or are still fighting the last one. 

My own opinion is that to run the world's principal super power, a modern state, on a two hundred and thirty year old document is a recipe for civil and political disaster.

On the other hand, at least they know what their constitution says.

Can you imagine the mess they would be in if they were muddling along arguing at gun point as to what an unwritten constitution was?

I did rather like Geoff's suggestion about the right to arm bears.

[dreampolice]

Apr 21, 2023 16:56:47 GMT willien said:

Apr 21, 2023 16:24:14 GMT squeamishossifrage said:

A weekend reading list, for those who enjoy either masochistic depression or 'serves you right' schadenfreude:-

HOW CIVIL WARS START

And How to Stop Them

By Barbara F. Walte

THE NEXT CIVIL WAR

Dispatches From the American Future

By Stephen Marche

Essentially, the authors expound the view that the US is either about to have another civil war or are still fighting the last one. 

My own opinion is that to run the world's principal super power, a modern state, on a two hundred and thirty year old document is a recipe for civil and political disaster.

On the other hand, at least they know what their constitution says.

Can you imagine the mess they would be in if they were muddling along arguing at gun point as to what an unwritten constitution was?

I did rather like Geoff's suggestion about the right to arm bears.

I hope the bear puts the gun somewhere safe when it craps in the woods.

[geoffr]

I did once suggest that the correct interpretation of the constitution was that Americans could bear arms but that it says nothing about ammunition. Thus my interpretation was, you can have all guns you wish but the ammunition stays in the militia headquarters until you need it.

Of course if you go back 250 years militia was the term used for law enforcement personnel, it is a more recent use of the term that leads to the NRA’s version. This would have the “disciplined militia” of the second amendment as the basis of a citizen force to assist the local sheriff, or who even was charged with upholding the law. The NRA seems to have neglected, possibly deliberately, the “disciplined” bit and gone with a free for all approach.

I find myself in broad agreement with Kath. Then I remember that the Pilgrim Fathers were puritans and Michaelangelo's David would have been very much unacceptable to them. The more so as it would have been seen as “Roman” (Roman catholic).

Bears are very responsible creatures, they avoid those strange two legged creatures as far as possible.

[MJB]

Apr 21, 2023 17:10:58 GMT dreampolice said:

I hope the bear puts the gun somewhere safe when it craps in the woods.

... But keeps it close to hand when having a crap at Oscar Pistorius' house.

[Ivor E Tower]

To me, it's as if the USA is going back to the "Wild West" we see in old movies. Anyone can carry a gun, used it whenever they feel like it to kill anyone they don't like.
I'm not sure that their Constitution was written with that in mind